D7100 in 15.3mp setting

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OK, I just watched this video - D7100 video

In it, he says that if the camera is set at the 15.3mp setting, the camera has a 2.0 crop factor instead of a 1.5. Does that mean that my 70-300 will become a 140-600? If so, look out orcas!! I'm thanking myself for not using my whale watch boat gift certificate yet. I'll wait and use it a couple of weeks from now :)

Carole
 
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OK, I just watched this video - D7100 video

In it, he says that if the camera is set at the 15.3mp setting, the camera has a 2.0 crop factor instead of a 1.5. Does that mean that my 70-300 will become a 140-600?

Carole
Yes, 140-600 "equivalent" FOV as compared to 35mm/FX...

Here's a good place to learn about the features of your new camera...

http://imaging.nikon.com/lineup/dslr/d7100/features01.htm

Scroll down a bit on that page to read about the 1.3x crop mode and use the
tabs at the top to learn about the rest of the spec's/features... :wink:
 
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Yes, 140-600 "equivalent" FOV as compared to 35mm/FX...

Here's a good place to learn about the features of your new camera...

http://imaging.nikon.com/lineup/dslr/d7100/features01.htm

Scroll down a bit on that page to read about the 1.3x crop mode and use the
tabs at the top to learn about the rest of the spec's/features... :wink:
Wow, look out whales! Here I come!

Thanks for the link, William. I'll go check it out now.

Carole
 
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OK, I just watched this video - D7100 video

In it, he says that if the camera is set at the 15.3mp setting, the camera has a 2.0 crop factor instead of a 1.5. Does that mean that my 70-300 will become a 140-600? If so, look out orcas!! I'm thanking myself for not using my whale watch boat gift certificate yet. I'll wait and use it a couple of weeks from now :)

Carole
Actually no. The 1.3 crop factor is just using a smaller area of your sensor, or cropping in the camera. If you were to shoot at full resolution and then crop in PP yourself, you would obtain the same result. You are not getting any extra "FOV reach" as occurs when choosing between FX and DX of the same mega-pixel count.

The D7100 and the FX D600 both have 24Mp sensors. Assume you put a 70-300mm lens on both cameras, and go shoot an Orca. You use the D7100 first and compose in the viewfinder so that the image contains 50% Orca and 50% ocean. If you are able to do this with a zoom setting of 200mm, on the D600 you would need to zoom to 300mm, or 1.5 * the 200mm DX value. The DX 1.5 crop factor means it requires a longer lens (by 1.5*) on an FX camera (of same Mp count) to get the same number of pixels covering the subject as a similar MP count DX camera.

So, with both cameras, the Orca would be covered by 50% of the available pixels or 50% * 24Mp = 12.0 Mp of Orca and 12 Mp of ocean background, but the DX 1.5 crop FOV factor allows you to get more "apparent reach" from your telephoto lens.

The 1.3 crop in the D7100 just masks off pixels as if you had a smaller than DX sized sensor, with only 15.3 Mp. Using the same zoom lens, set to the same 200mm on the D7100 with the 1.3 crop enabled, the Orca will now fill the masked off frame to a greater percentage, but the total number of pixels on the subject Orca does not change. NO additional telephoto reach. You still have 12 Mp of Orca, but only 3.2 Mp of ocean background surrounding it. The same result as if you shot at 200mm in 24 Mp mode and manually cropped to 15.3Mp in PP.
 
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Actually no. The 1.3 crop factor is just using a smaller area of your sensor, or cropping in the camera. If you were to shoot at full resolution and then crop in PP yourself, you would obtain the same result. You are not getting any extra "FOV reach" as occurs when choosing between FX and DX of the same mega-pixel count.

The D7100 and the FX D600 both have 24Mp sensors. Assume you put a 70-300mm lens on both cameras, and go shoot an Orca. You use the D7100 first and compose in the viewfinder so that the image contains 50% Orca and 50% ocean. If you are able to do this with a zoom setting of 200mm, on the D600 you would need to zoom to 300mm, or 1.5 * the 200mm DX value. The DX 1.5 crop factor means it requires a longer lens (by 1.5*) on an FX camera (of same Mp count) to get the same number of pixels covering the subject as a similar MP count DX camera.

So, with both cameras, the Orca would be covered by 50% of the available pixels or 50% * 24Mp = 12.0 Mp of Orca and 12 Mp of ocean background, but the DX 1.5 crop FOV factor allows you to get more "apparent reach" from your telephoto lens.

The 1.3 crop in the D7100 just masks off pixels as if you had a smaller than DX sized sensor, with only 15.3 Mp. Using the same zoom lens, set to the same 200mm on the D7100 with the 1.3 crop enabled, the Orca will now fill the masked off frame to a greater percentage, but the total number of pixels on the subject Orca does not change. NO additional telephoto reach. You still have 12 Mp of Orca, but only 3.2 Mp of ocean background surrounding it. The same result as if you shot at 200mm in 24 Mp mode and manually cropped to 15.3Mp in PP.
You're forgetting about "density"...

A 24MP APS-C sensor has much more pixel density than a 24MP FF sensor... The APS-C "size" crop from a D600 (24MP FF)
is only 10+MP... The APS-C "size" crop from the D800 (36MP FF) is only 15+MP... If you made a FF sensor with the same
pixel-pitch (density) as the D7100 it would be around 57MP (approx, +/-... My math is rounded off)... A 15MP crop from
a 24MP APS-C sensor would have less Field of View/Angle of View than a 15MP crop from a 24MP FF sensor...

It is stated right on the Nikon site about the D7100 1.3 crop mode:

Furthermore, when the image area of 1.3x crop of DX is selected, the angle of view becomes equivalent to that
of a lens with about double the focal length in 35mm format.
In DX format, the angle of view becomes equivalent to that of a lens with approx. 1.5 times longer focal length*1.
In the newly employed 1.3x crop of DX mode, it becomes equivalent to that of a lens with approx. 1.3 times longer
focal length*1 than in DX format. As a result, the angle of view becomes equivalent to that of a lens with
about double the focal length
*1

*1 = When converted to 35mm format.
Source: http://imaging.nikon.com/lineup/dslr/d7100/features01.htm
 
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CHARLOTTE
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to my eyes the in camera crop looks better, as in more detail....
it's certainly no worse and when I know what I want is in the center i'll flip to 2x and shoot and the very least I get more fps and smaller files
 
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So, with both cameras, the Orca would be covered by 50% of the available pixels or 50% * 24Mp = 12.0 Mp of Orca and 12 Mp of ocean background, but the DX 1.5 crop FOV factor allows you to get more "apparent reach" from your telephoto lens.

The 1.3 crop in the D7100 just masks off pixels as if you had a smaller than DX sized sensor, with only 15.3 Mp. Using the same zoom lens, set to the same 200mm on the D7100 with the 1.3 crop enabled, the Orca will now fill the masked off frame to a greater percentage, but the total number of pixels on the subject Orca does not change. NO additional telephoto reach. You still have 12 Mp of Orca, but only 3.2 Mp of ocean background surrounding it. The same result as if you shot at 200mm in 24 Mp mode and manually cropped to 15.3Mp in PP.
You're forgetting about "density"...

...
It is stated right on the Nikon site about the D7100 1.3 crop mode:
If I read him correctly, he is still showing the 15.3, broken down into 12 Orca, the rest Ocean.

The confusion, as usual, is that the 1.3 factor does not "make" your lens longer, as is pointed out it is just as if you cropped the same area.

Carole, I like the 1.3 crop factor, but do remember it is just the camera cropping the area for you "up front" so to speak. The advantages are:
1. smaller file size
2. slighty faster FPS

The downside:
1. less flexibility in cropping, since you no longer have the area that would have shown up in the "normal" DX mode.

I must say that since I got the D800 and the D7100, the ability to crop over my D300's is really a joy.
 
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to my eyes the in camera crop looks better, as in more detail....
it's certainly no worse and when I know what I want is in the center i'll flip to 2x and shoot and the very least I get more fps and smaller files
The "in camera crop" cannot be any better, as it is exactly the same pixels. What I do find, however, is that it certainl looks better when I chimp, since the subject is already larger on the LCD, due to the crop.
 
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Actually no. The 1.3 crop factor is just using a smaller area of your sensor, or cropping in the camera. If you were to shoot at full resolution and then crop in PP yourself, you would obtain the same result. You are not getting any extra "FOV reach" as occurs when choosing between FX and DX of the same mega-pixel count.

The D7100 and the FX D600 both have 24Mp sensors. Assume you put a 70-300mm lens on both cameras, and go shoot an Orca. You use the D7100 first and compose in the viewfinder so that the image contains 50% Orca and 50% ocean. If you are able to do this with a zoom setting of 200mm, on the D600 you would need to zoom to 300mm, or 1.5 * the 200mm DX value. The DX 1.5 crop factor means it requires a longer lens (by 1.5*) on an FX camera (of same Mp count) to get the same number of pixels covering the subject as a similar MP count DX camera.

So, with both cameras, the Orca would be covered by 50% of the available pixels or 50% * 24Mp = 12.0 Mp of Orca and 12 Mp of ocean background, but the DX 1.5 crop FOV factor allows you to get more "apparent reach" from your telephoto lens.

The 1.3 crop in the D7100 just masks off pixels as if you had a smaller than DX sized sensor, with only 15.3 Mp. Using the same zoom lens, set to the same 200mm on the D7100 with the 1.3 crop enabled, the Orca will now fill the masked off frame to a greater percentage, but the total number of pixels on the subject Orca does not change. NO additional telephoto reach. You still have 12 Mp of Orca, but only 3.2 Mp of ocean background surrounding it. The same result as if you shot at 200mm in 24 Mp mode and manually cropped to 15.3Mp in PP.
So if I take the shot at 24mp, and crop it myself when I get home (which is what I normally do now), I'll get the same quality photo as if I let the camera crop it?

Carole
 
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tell that to my eyes:biggrin:
Like they would listen any better than you would???? :eek::eek:

:biggrin::biggrin:

So if I take the shot at 24mp, and crop it myself when I get home (which is what I normally do now), I'll get the same quality photo as if I let the camera crop it?

Carole
Think about the process. What the "1.3 crop mode" is doing is taking that middle 15.3 MP of the 24mp image and writing that to the card. The same pixels, off the same sensor. Now, there is one thing that can affect this, and that is the placement of the AF sensors and which ones are being used. If you are using all the AF sensors I could see where your focus might be a bit different between the 1.3 and the full DX mode. Then to when you process your image, your software may interpret slightly differently if it can "see" all 24MP vs the 15.3, see the example above regarind the Orca vs. Ocean. If you are allowing your software to doing any auto adjustments, the larger amount of Ocean could affect those.

But at the base level, same sensor, same pixels, so how could it be any different?

If someone knows differently, I'd sure like to know.
 
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If I read him correctly, he is still showing the 15.3, broken down into 12 Orca, the rest Ocean.

The confusion, as usual, is that the 1.3 factor does not "make" your lens longer, as is pointed out it is just as if you cropped the same area.

The confusion is that an APS-C "PHYSICAL SIZE" (NOT Pegapixel) crop from a 24MP FF camera
is 10MP, NOT 15MP... 15MP on a D600 24MP FF sensor is a "physically larger" area of the sensor
than the "physical size" of an APS-C sensor therefore a greater FOV... This is beacause the D600
24MP sensor has LESS pixels per square mm than the D7100 24MP APS-C sensor... The D7100
sensor is "denser" (MORE pixels per square mm)...

APS-C is a physical size/area not a MP count...

This means that to get the same FOV as the D7100 24MP APS-C sensor from the D600 24MP FF
sensor you would have to crop to a 10MP image... To get the the same FOV as the 1.3x crop of the
D7100 APS-C sensor from the D600 24MP FF sensor you would have to crop (of the top of my
head) to an 8MP image...

To crop a 100mm lens to give the equivalent FOV as a 200mm lens (*) on the D7100 leaves you with
a 15MP image... To crop a 100mm lens to give the equivalent FOV as a 200mm lens (*) on the D600
leaves you with an 8MP (roughly) image...

(*) = Equivalent compared to 35mm format
 
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Think about the process. What the "1.3 crop mode" is doing is taking that middle 15.3 MP of the 24mp image and writing that to the card. The same pixels, off the same sensor. Now, there is one thing that can affect this, and that is the placement of the AF sensors and which ones are being used. If you are using all the AF sensors I could see where your focus might be a bit different between the 1.3 and the full DX mode. Then to when you process your image, your software may interpret slightly differently if it can "see" all 24MP vs the 15.3, see the example above regarind the Orca vs. Ocean. If you are allowing your software to doing any auto adjustments, the larger amount of Ocean could affect those.

But at the base level, same sensor, same pixels, so how could it be any different?

If someone knows differently, I'd sure like to know.
OK, I've got it now :) I'll have to try this out once the camera gets here. Since I'm near the harbor, I can go down and shoot a sailboat and just see what the camera does.

I think I'm going to be having fun next week! :biggrin:

Carole
 
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Methinks we are talking apples and qumquats here :wink:, but are really coming to the same conclusion.

You are absolutely correct regarding the physical sizes and portions of the sensor. I was simply speaking to the issue of the person you responded to, where I saw how he came to the same 15.3mp for the 1.3 crop.

My "confusion" comment is that people continue to think this somehow changes the "reach" of the lens, which as you point out it does not.

Hope that clears this up a bit.

The confusion is that an APS-C "PHYSICAL SIZE" (NOT Pegapixel) crop from a 24MP FF camera
is 10MP, NOT 15MP... 15MP on a D600 24MP FF sensor is a "physically larger" area of the sensor
than the "physical size" of an APS-C sensor therefore a greater FOV... This is beacause the D600
24MP sensor has LESS pixels per square mm than the D7100 24MP APS-C sensor... The D7100
sensor is "denser" (MORE pixels per square mm)...

APS-C is a physical size/area not a MP count...

This means that to get the same FOV as the D7100 24MP APS-C sensor from the D600 24MP FF
sensor you would have to crop to a 10MP image... To get the the same FOV as the 1.3x crop of the
D7100 APS-C sensor from the D600 24MP FF sensor you would have to crop (of the top of my
head) to an 8MP image...

To crop a 100mm lens to give the equivalent FOV as a 200mm lens on the D7100 leaves you with
a 15MP image... To crop a 100mm lens to give the equivalent FOV as a 200mm lens on the D600
leaves you with an 8MP (roughly) image...
 
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The confusion is that an APS-C "PHYSICAL SIZE" (NOT Pegapixel) crop from a 24MP FF camera
is 10MP, NOT 15MP... 15MP on a D600 24MP FF sensor is a "physically larger" area of the sensor
than the "physical size" of an APS-C sensor therefore a greater FOV... This is beacause the D600
24MP sensor has LESS pixels per square mm than the D7100 24MP APS-C sensor... The D7100
sensor is "denser" (MORE pixels per square mm)...

APS-C is a physical size/area not a MP count...

This means that to get the same FOV as the D7100 24MP APS-C sensor from the D600 24MP FF
sensor you would have to crop to a 10MP image... To get the the same FOV as the 1.3x crop of the
D7100 APS-C sensor from the D600 24MP FF sensor you would have to crop (of the top of my
head) to an 8MP image...

To crop a 100mm lens to give the equivalent FOV as a 200mm lens (*) on the D7100 leaves you with
a 15MP image... To crop a 100mm lens to give the equivalent FOV as a 200mm lens (*) on the D600
leaves you with an 8MP (roughly) image...

(*) = Equivalent compared to 35mm format
what:confused:

so can it be better cropped in the body and can that old man from the NW be wrong for once, just once
 
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what:confused:

so can it be better cropped in the body and can that old man from the NW be wrong for once, just once
I'd prefer cropped in the body myself just for convenience sake and smaller files...

If you know before hand you're only going to use the center portion why waste
time with PP'ing and waste storage/file size carrying around the extra...?
 
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Brandon, FL
I just answered my own question. I just shot with my D2x in standard mode with a 50mm f1.4 prime and the exif showed 75mm f1.4. I then shot in high speed crop and the exif showed 100mm f1.4. I then did the same with my D7100 and the results were identical. So it looks like you are getting the crop in camera rather than post as mentioned above. My question would be do you get the same IQ using the crop mode versus cropping afterwards.
 

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