Leica M4-P?

[Chris101]

Anyone know anything about this particular Canadian-made camera? There's one for sale in a local shop with a Voigtlander 35mm lens.

 

[dmwphoto]

I have seen M4 bodies in "user" condition go for 900 -1000. I have never used one

 

[Removed User 2]

Chris, this is the one I use :biggrin:! It's the one in my Avatar.
Just buy it! That'll make 2 of us!
Make sure the speeds are fine, that the 1 second setting sounds firm without hesitation.
Make sure the viewfinder focuses exactly at infinity and that the windows aren't flush with the body.
The M4-P is basically an M6 but made in Canada. The M4-P is excellent with a 35mm lens (match made in heaven, IMO) and the M3 is the best match for a 50.
The CV 35mm lens is great and has become hard to fine.

I will send you a PM regarding a Pro repairman's opinion on the M4-P and other Leica cameras. Basically he said that you must CLA it once everry 15-20 years and you'll use it forever.

Shoot it at f8 on hyperfocal and don't bother focusing.

Can,t wait for your shots! :biggrin:!!!!!!!

 

[Chris101]

Thanks Dave and Ned (and for the additional info.) I will go look at it in person next week.

 

[cellison]

I've been kicking around the idea of getting a Leica lately but have no idea where to start. I'm getting the impression that the M3 is quite well liked but I'm pretty ignorant when it comes to Lecia lenses.

If you end up getting the M4-P Chris I'll be interested in hearing your thoughts.

I want to take a camera with me more often and find that SLR's are just too bulky and awkward.

Chris

 

[Chris101]

Hey Chris - I'm just in the curiosity and exploration phase myself. Some of my favorite photographers use Leica cameras, and I do like the diminutive size. It's hard though, to beat my favorite slr for that - the OM1n. They look to be about the same size. I've used rangefinder cameras, but I can't say I've ever used a good one. Even bad ones are a snap to focus.

There is a Leica forum on photo.net, and they discuss the various lenses a LOT.

 

[cellison]

Thanks for pointing me towards the photo.net forums Chris... I also found RangeFinderForum.com which also seems to be a good resource.

I noticed that Ned posts on the RFF and in fact says he has an M3 for sale.

Ned, would your M3 be a good Leica for someone like me new to rangefinders? How much are you asking for it?

Chris

 

[Removed User 2]

Thanks for pointing me towards the photo.net forums Chris... I also found RangeFinderForum.com which also seems to be a good resource.

I noticed that Ned posts on the RFF and in fact says he has an M3 for sale.

Ned, would your M3 be a good Leica for someone like me new to rangefinders? How much are you asking for it?

Chris

I post there from time to time...
Yes I have an M3 for sale (I have 2 M3's and one has to go). Since they are CLA'd and professionally repainted and recovered, my 0$ profit price is in the 1300$ range. For this price you bet you are receiving a good and fresh M3 rather then a scratched 50 year old tired camera. The good and truly mint (Not ebay mint) M3 Leicas go in the 800-1200$ range.

 

[cellison]

I post there from time to time...
Yes I have an M3 for sale (I have 2 M3's and one has to go). Since they are CLA'd and professionally repainted and recovered, my 0$ profit price is in the 1300$ range. For this price you bet you are receiving a good and fresh M3 rather then a scratched 50 year old tired camera. The good and truly mint (Not ebay mint) M3 Leicas go in the 800-1200$ range.

Ned,

I'm in Ottawa... are those CDN or US dollars? Do you have a lens recommendation for the M3? You mentioned a 50mm would be ideal. Any idea what price range I'd be looking at for the lens? Is there a reason a 35mm lens wouldn't work as well?

I'm trying to get an idea of what the total cost would be to get into a Leica system.

Thanks for your time Ned and sorry for hijacking your thread Chris :O

Chris

 

[Removed User 2]

Chris,

The prices are in USD (cheap these days!)
The M3 is highly regarded for 2 reasons:
1-It's the best mechanical M. It's the first and the legendary one. All the rest we're somewhat cut down.
2-It has a big viewfinder (the biggest). Its viewfinder represents a 50mm view. Almost all Leicas except the M3 have a 35mm viewfinder with a 50mm crop inside. This makes using 35mm lenses very easy but anything longer (50, 75, 90) is harder because the crop is smaller and smaller. It's all in the viewfinder's magnification.

This is why the M3 is best used with a 50mm lens and a 90mm lens. Anything above 75mm is hard to use with all other M cameras bacause of the lesser magnification.

That is also why any Leica user has to own 2 Leicas. One M3 for a 50mm lens and any other M for a 35mm lens :smile:

I recommend teh Voigtlander 50mm f1.5 Nokton. It's fairly cheap and the sharpest 50 I've ever tried. In fact, all the Voigtlander lenses are cheap and excellent. They represent an easy entry into Rangefinders and into the Leica system.
The 15mm, 21mm are great. The 35 f1.2 is unique. And the super small and cheap 35 f2.5 is a must have: It fits in a backpocket!

 

[Chris101]

... sorry for hijacking your thread Chris :O

Hijack away Chris (and all.) The more y'all chat, the more I learn about these sought after cameras.

 

[Julien]

Oh great now the Film forum is turning into another Lust forum ... thanks guys that's just what I needed :tongue:

 

[rodneyAB]

Hey Chris - I'm just in the curiosity and exploration phase myself. Some of my favorite photographers use Leica cameras, and I do like the diminutive size. It's hard though, to beat my favorite slr for that - the OM1n. They look to be about the same size. I've used rangefinder cameras, but I can't say I've ever used a good one. Even bad ones are a snap to focus.

There is a Leica forum on photo.net, and they discuss the various lenses a LOT.

the OM2 is the best for lightweight but solid feel in the slr, it fits so well in my hand and the body surface area is all available for handgrip without interfering with the viewfinder, which invariably, on my MP3, gets covered with fingerprints, or is partially obscured by my finger when trying to focus. the body size is very similiar, the OM slightly smaller in height and length for the main body, but deeper due to the shutter speed dial, and of course the prism case on the OM makes it higher in that region. the MP3 with body cap feels like a small dense brick, the OM feels like the small SLR camera it is. with the 24mm zuiko on the OM2...stealthy, but still an obvious shutter/mirror slap with exposure....but nothing like the FM2n/FM3a shutter noise and mirror slam...feels like the FM wants to jump from my grip at exposure, relative to the OM2, and of course the simple quiet click of the MP3 is stealthiest of them all, with 1/8th second handholdable shutter speeds possible, where you need 1/60th on the OM2:smile: , and about 1/500th :biggrin: on the FM3...

 

[MontyDog]

#1064 - You have an error in your SQL syntax;

 

[John C]

If I ever spent real money on a Rangefinder, I think my choice would be a Bessa R2 or 3. Even bought new you'd have a heap of change to put towards glass if you had Leica money burning a hole in your pocket Frances Shultz reviews the Bessa R3 in this month's "Black and White Photography" magazine - I'm not sure if you can get it outside the UK, so let me know if you're interested Chris, and I'll drop the scanned article to you in an email.

The Leicas are beautiful cameras, but they're way too aspirational, imo, and the prices seem to reflect that.

As Ned says, the CV lenses are great - one of my contacts on flickr uses the 15mm heliar and 35mm ultron a lot, and they look superb.

Incidentally, RodneyAB's comment on mirror slap made me chuckle - I had a Practika MTL3 once that I swear set off seismographs when I pressed the shutter release The SLR that always felt best to me was the OM40 - it had the most beautifully damped mirror.

 

[Julien]

John I'd be interested in that article about the Bessa R3. I clearly don't have the budget for a new camera now but these Voigtlanders seem really tempting :smile:

 

[cellison]

If I ever spent real money on a Rangefinder, I think my choice would be a Bessa R2 or 3. Even bought new you'd have a heap of change to put towards glass if you had Leica money burning a hole in your pocket Frances Shultz reviews the Bessa R3 in this month's "Black and White Photography" magazine - I'm not sure if you can get it outside the UK, so let me know if you're interested Chris, and I'll drop the scanned article to you in an email.

The Leicas are beautiful cameras, but they're way too aspirational, imo, and the prices seem to reflect that.

As Ned says, the CV lenses are great - one of my contacts on flickr uses the 15mm heliar and 35mm ultron a lot, and they look superb.

Incidentally, RodneyAB's comment on mirror slap made me chuckle - I had a Practika MTL3 once that I swear set off seismographs when I pressed the shutter release The SLR that always felt best to me was the OM40 - it had the most beautifully damped mirror.

John,

I would be very interested in the article, thanks for the offer! I'm still soaking it all in

 

[Chris101]

I'm pretty sure Barnes & Noble sells Black and White Photography magazine. It had a picture of a young and brunette Bardot on the cover last month, right? It's a cool magazine. It focusses solely on making monochrome photographs. There is a new American mag called B+W that does the same, not to be confused with B&W which is about collecting and discussing mono images.

 

[cellison]

We don't have Barnes & Noble here in Canada but I'll check the local Chapters. It sounds like it easy to buy the wrong magazine

Chris

 

[John C]

The issue with the Voigtlander review in has a large "Magnum at 60" strapline on it, and a picture of a reclining Marilyn Monroe - it's issue 72, May 2007.