Lightroom & HP Printing Problem (NEW Photos Added)

Discussion in 'Adobe Processing Products' started by Minuteman3, Jun 26, 2007.

  1. Since MS unceremoniously pulled the plug on my beloved Digital Imaging Suite, I tried out a bunch of processing/work flow applications. Although I'll continue to use NX for a few things, I've decided to try to learn and focus on Lightroom for most day-to-day tasks.

    I have already discovered a bit of a problem with printing. I do not know enough yet to putz with settings, so everything is "default" out of the box. I am printing to a HP PhotoSmart 3210 which has generally been pretty good with prints.

    Here's what a sample image looked like in LR:

    [​IMG]

    Here's a scan of the resulting print:

    p312198907-4.

    (I understand there are variables with scanning a print, but what I see on my screen for this scan is very close to exactly what I see on the print.)

    The prints appear to be too dark. Others have had very muted color in addition to being dark.

    (And when I print these with DIS, they are almost a perfect match to the screen image.)

    Is there something in the LR settings that I should use to improve these prints?

    Thanks in advance ...

    Ken
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 28, 2007
  2. Lowolf

    Lowolf

    Jan 26, 2006
    Oregon
    what printer profile are you choosing to print to?
     
  3. My only option is "managed by printer". The print driver indicates it is using sRGB as a color profile. (The image was also shot in sRGB, if that makes a difference ...)

    I have not looked for a specific profile for this printer ... off to Google for a while!!

    Cheers!!

    Ken
     
  4. Lowolf

    Lowolf

    Jan 26, 2006
    Oregon
    profile managed by printer click other select your paper profile
     
  5. Printing managed by printer seems to be pretty hit and miss.
    Go through the steps of:

    Page set up
    Printer settings - save these as standard
    Set the settings for resolution and sharpening.
    Under Colour Management - Set the profile for your paper as has been mentioned in the above posts
    Print - check the settings here as well


    Last of all look out for the v1.1 release
     
  6. OK, I think I hit on the major problem. I needed to select the "ICM" option on the printer properties portion of the print driver itself. (Windows) That improved the quality immensely.

    It's still not a 100% match to what I am seeing on the (calibrated) monitor, but it's significantly closer.

    Upgrading to 1.1 may also have helped.

    This looks like it's my only option as when I look in LR for printer profiles, the box is blank. I guess I don't have any!!

    Cheers!!

    Ken
     
  7. billg71

    billg71

    693
    May 4, 2007
    Atlanta, GA
    Ken,

    To add paper profiles to Lightroom, under Print Job, open Color Management. You should see 2 choices, Managed By Printer and Other. Selecting Other opens up a dialog box which lists all the paper profiles installed on your computer. If you haven't created or added any yourself, there should at least be the default HP profiles installed with your printer driver.

    Click on the check box next to the profiles you want to add, click OK, and when you return to the Profiles drop-down, they'll appear. Select the one that best matches your paper and you're off.

    If you don't see any profiles in the dialog box, try downloading the latest drivers for your printer and installing them.

    Best,

    Bill
     
  8. Ken, what Bill says and what I said.
    The steps need to be followed carefully.
     
  9. I guess I'm going backwards after all. I tried another printout from LR and it looks much worse. Here's the original (it's from the Vista beta and is VERY colorful. The original is 2.1 MB so I reduced it in size for posting):

    [​IMG]

    I tried printing this from LR with the setup suggested (ie color space managed by printer, and ICM enabled on the printer. The only icc profiles on the printer driver dialog were for HP Premium Plus Paper, and that's what I used.) It was printed at the default 240 DPI. The top one in the image below is what came out of LR. The bottom one is using Vista's plain old photo printing wizard and accepting all defaults. The two 4x6 prints were both scanned on the same pass so that variable should be pretty small. Obviously, something is messed up!!

    [​IMG]

    Part of this MAY well be the printer. Even though I have the latest drivers, there are no separate color profiles available. When I check the COLOR MANAGED --> OTHER dialog, the box is blank and I cannot add anything.

    I also wonder if this is part of Adobe's little war with MS over Vista. If so, it's a shame that big companies act more like 8 year olds than MY 8 year old does!!

    Thanks in advance for helping me work through this.

    Cheers!!

    Ken
     
  10. First, there is no Adobe little war Ken.
    Second, have you read the instructions on printing in the manual?
    I don't know about HP printers but in the your printer dialog you must turn colour management off. If not there will be double profiling as LR does it. That is what your print looks like.
    Try again and keep us informed.

    p.s. it took me a bit to figure it out but it is great now.
     
  11. Geoff

    I have tried every option I can in the HP print dialog, they ALL look like the dark one in the sample. When I specified the "Adobe RGB" space in the print driver, it was marginally better, but still nowhere as good as the plain old Windows print!!

    Thinking this may be a printer issue, I tried printing the same photo on my color laser. Same bad colors came out, so I suspect this is more to do with LR than the "system."

    I opened a support case with Adobe since I just purchased this copy of LR last week. It will be interesting to see if they have any ideas.

    (My comment about Adobe/MS is a reference to this quote from a guy who writes about MS stuff: "Critics are charging Adobe with harming customers as payback for Microsoft's decision to compete directly with Adobe in various markets, including Web publishing, document creation, and high-end graphics. Adobe, to date, has been silent about these charges." Of course, we all know that such stuff on the web can be absolute dribble, and in this case it may well be. But considering how ALL technology companies seem to occasionally behave like spoiled children, I would not be surprised. For example, I noticed today when I opened the support incident at Adobe on this printing issue, Windows Vista was not listed as a viable operating system....)

    Cheers!!

    Ken
     
  12. Ken, thanks for hanging in there!! It can be confusing or it was for me:confused::confused:

    Have you followed the set up steps in LR as mentioned carefully?
    When printing from LR (not managed by printer) colour management in the the printer dialog must be turned off.
    Try and not get too frustrated, there will be a "penny drop" moment and all will become clear - even the prints too!!

    These are the steps to follow:
    After you have set your template etc and have the layout as you want using the "image Settings", "Layout" and "overlays" panes in the right hand panel then-
    1. Go to Page Set Up (in the tool bar area) and set the appropriate options there. You will need to work those out as I use a Mac and Epson and they will probably vary from your dialog. I set the printer and page size and orientation, then "save as default".

    2. Go to the next button - "Print Settings" and work down the dialog box. Again what I see may be different to yours but I:
    a. select printer (again)
    b. ignore presets at this point
    c. layout etc - here I need to go down to print settings to select the paper type and print quality ( here the icc/m profile is not shown just the paper types as here the ink spread is being set. Then at the colour management drop down select "OFF". This is critical.
    d. Then I go back up to presets and "save as standard". This is done for each template.
    e. Click save at the bottom of the Print dialog box (where it has cancel/save)

    3. Back in the LR right panel at the bottom we go to the "Print Job" pane and work down (ignoring the "draft printing check box) and
    a. set the resolution you want ( or you can deselect this in the check box the and resolution of the file will be used). It is best to use a number that is a whole division of the printer resolution i.e. I use 240 for the Epson's resolution of 1440.
    b. Set the sharpening amount you want, this will vary
    c. Ensure that "Colour Management" is active by clicking the arrow is pointing down.
    d. "Profile" - select "OTHER" - this will activate a window with the profiles on your computer that are available. Check the ones you wish to use.
    e. Select the "rendering intent". I believe that relative is the most widely used but test for your situation.

    LAST PRESS THE PRINT BUTTON at bottom right ( but you knew that!!)

    After all that send me an email to: service@villageimage.co.nz and let me know what I missed in this!!!
    :wink::wink::smile::smile::biggrin::biggrin::eek::eek:
     
  13. Geoff

    Well, I just had an interesting couple of hours on the phone with Adobe. Basically, since my printer does not appear to have a "profile" among their Vista drivers, Adobe's solution is to always print in DRAFT mode, which turns the color management chores over to the printer. (Actually, this does work and the image comes out fine.) Anything else they suggested resulted in no improvement.

    In the longer term, perhaps one avenue may be to get a bit higher grade printer. I have been thinking of something in the Epson R1800 class anyway, so this may push me over. I think I will post something in the Printer Forum to see if anyone has had success with a Vista+Lightroom+R1800 combination!!

    That being said, I must admit the support tech at Adobe was not as much help as I'd hoped. Basically, she (and the others she was obviously conferring with) had no clue how to work with Vista. For example, she had me search for files that are non-existent on my machine. Her suggested pathways did not exist on my machine. At one point, she even said that she did not have a Vista machine to refer to. She was mightily perplexed as to why the print would come out bad in LR but fine in PSE. All in all, not a real positive experience.

    A bit surprising since Vista has been out 6 months and sold millions of copies. I can't be the only one to have "issues."!!

    But, thank you VERY MUCH for YOUR assistance!! I remain intrigued with LR and hope it will work out.

    Cheers!!

    Ken
     
  14. Colour management is a perplexing thing at times.
    LR does work best with fully managed colour systems. Your printer may not be up to it, also is your monitor calibrated?
    This alone will make a huge difference, so please tell me what you do for colour management with your system and applications.
    Hope we can get to the bottom of this.
     
  15. I am using Spyder2Express for calibration and the monitor indeed shifts colors slightly on startup so I know it's working!! Although I am NOT an expert by any means, I understand that color management in Vista is pretty well done. I could send you some screen shots of the various management screens if you think that might help.

    Thanks again.

    Ken
     
  16. Yep that might help, either post them here or email them to me @:
    service@villageimage.co.nz
     
  17. Geoff

    Tell you what ... let's put this "issue" on standby. I just ordered an Epson R1800 (due to be delivered today) and I'll see if having a full batch of color profiles makes a difference (I hope it does!!).

    Thanks again for your willingness to assist.

    Cheers!!

    Ken
     
  18. After a couple of hours, it clearly DOES make a difference!! My prints are coming out much better. Since the prints also looked bad on my color laser (with no specific profiles listed), perhaps this is a Windows/Vista/LR issue. Just doesn't like simple printers!!

    Thanks again for your assistance.

    Cheers!!

    Ken
     

  19. Glad to here your news ken, I too use an 1800 and the results are good. Ran out of ink last Friday and did a print on a 3800 and you couldn't tell the difference!!

    Enjoy LR !!:smile::smile:
     
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