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NX2:Gen - Commands - File Labeling Issues

Discussion in 'Nikon Capture and View NX' started by DrJay32, Jul 7, 2008.

  1. DrJay32

    DrJay32

    254
    Oct 14, 2006
    Colorado, USA
    OK, I've spent a LOT of time scratching my head and emailing several tech people at Camera Bits (Photo Mechanic) and Nik (NX2) to get this figured out.

    Some of us have reported troubles getting labels in NX 2.0 to be visible in other XMP-aware applications. For me, it is Photo Mechanic.

    First, some background. In order for labels to be synchronized between Capture NX 2.0 and another application, you need the label names to be identical between programs. If you use Photo Mechanic, you also need to enable it to embed IPTC4XMP data into NEFs (TIFF-based RAW files) and read XMP data as first priority.

    Now here's where the weirdness begins. If you apply a label to a NEF in the NX file browser and click "Apply" and then go back to Photo Mechanic, you'll see the color label change. However, if the NEF is open in the Edit Window and you make a label change and then subsequently save the file, the label is NOT updated in Photo Mechanic.

    HUH???

    Well, it turns out that there is an issue between the NX file browser and NX proper. Capture NX is actually using TWO different methods to label your files. The first method (and why most programs couldn't read NX 1 labels) is the Photoshop "Urgency" fields in the metadata (not XMP). The NX 2 File Browser also updates the XMP "Label" field with whatever name you've applied to your label. When a NEF is open in NX 2's edit window and you save the file, the "Urgency" field is updated but the "label" XMP field is not.

    This is where you can run into problems. If you have a file saved in NX and then change the label in Photo Mechanic, you can get a totally decoupled label (the name and number don't match).

    If you ONLY use the NX File Browser, you won't notice any issues.

    The workaround for this is to not SAVE NEFs after changing a label value in the NX 2 browser. Save your file, change the label, click apply, and then close the file. When NX asks you if you want to save the file, click NO.

    For the record Nik Software is fully aware of the issue and they are working on ways to fix it.

    -Jason
     
  2. TomaS

    TomaS

    497
    Aug 3, 2006
    Corrales, NM
    Too weird! Just when I thought the issues with labels / keywords in NX could not get any more confusing.....
     
  3. I'm actually feeling pretty good about this thread. I had no idea that any program would be able to read the labels or the stars. I'm gonna rename the labels in Digital Pro to match my labels in NX2 to determine if DP will read them.
     
  4. I renamed the labels in Digital Pro to match the labels in NX but Digital Pro still isn't reading many of the labels correctly.
     
  5. DrJay32

    DrJay32

    254
    Oct 14, 2006
    Colorado, USA
    Does DP read embedded XMP or only sidecar files?

    -Jason
     
  6. It reads and writes both. It writes to one or the other at the user's discretion.

    I just learned of IDimager from Tomas, who upon initial examination says that it reads Capture NX's keywords, all captioning data, stars and labels and that Capture NX reads the same when input using IDimage. It makes me wonder if IDimage is the holy grail in that regard. He notes that it writes to the NEF but doesn't mention whether there is an option to write to a sidecar file. Tomas, please add that clarification.

    EDIT: IDimager's website mentions that "Sidecar File Support" is "self configurable" in the professional edition and is "only predefined" in the personal edition, which is the standard lower-cost version.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 8, 2008
  7. TomaS

    TomaS

    497
    Aug 3, 2006
    Corrales, NM
    I downloaded the personal edition. The default is to write sidecar files. I just checked that option and it works fine too. Not sure what that quote from the IDimager website means. Here is a quote from the help file about NEF file embedding:

    File formats that allow embedded storage of meta information include: PSD, JPG, TIFF, CRW (through THM) and DNG. Some other RAW formats, such as NEF, CR2, PEF and ORF, allow storing meta information to the file itself, but some RAW converters will fail to work once the original RAW file is altered. To preserve maximum interoperability, IDimager is configured by default not to embed meta information in RAW files; to enable storing meta information to RAW files, change the setting in the options dialog (Tools | Options | General | Allow embedded meta writing for RAW files). However, it is strongly recommended that you first experiment on a copy of a RAW file to confirm that your RAW converter and other third party tools are able to handle altered RAW files.

    Some image formats, such as BMP, GIF, ICO, etc., do not allow you to write embedded meta information. For these formats a "sidecar" file is created that holds the meta information. This sidecar file has the same base name as the original file but uses a different extension: .xmp. For example: if you are working with a BMP file named "Sample.bmp", meta information for this file will be stored in a sidecar file named “Sample.xmp”.
     
  8. The website information combined with the help screen information you provided leads me to believe that the professional version allows the user to determine whether the XMP data is written to the NEF or to the sidecar file.
     
  9. TomaS

    TomaS

    497
    Aug 3, 2006
    Corrales, NM
    I just did that with the personal edition. just a matter checking an option box.
     
  10. mphillips

    mphillips

    32
    Jul 8, 2008
    South Africa
    Hi there

    AFAIK Hert (The author of IDimager) was stating a "disclaimer".

    I have been using IDimager Desktop Pro for about a year with RAW embedding and have not had a single problem.

    IDimager also handles sidecar files "seamlessly" eg when you delete a file the sidecar is also deleted or moved, etc..

    Just as a matter of process.. IDimager stores all its cataloguing information in a database and you then "sync" the information to the NEF and/or the sidecar. So you even have the option not to store your cataloging information "in/with" the image file. The info is also written so that "any" other program can read the sidecar file.(XMP)

    Regards

    MikeP
     
  11. Mike, we're honored that your first post was such a good contribution to this thread. Welcome to the Cafe! You might want to announce your arrival in the welcome thread.
     
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