Starting new pc build; i7-950, ASUS P6TD Deluxe

Growltiger

Administrator
Administrator
Joined
Apr 26, 2008
Messages
12,354
Location
Up in the hills, Gloucestershire, UK
I only bought it a month ago. It is D0 stepping.

The case is inferior but is a full size tower. It has no additional fans. It has three SATA disks. There is the power supply fan and the fan on the CPU, that is all.

I installed the motherboard, memory and CPU myself, and I know I fitted it properly.

The ASUS Probe program shows me the core voltage. Core voltage goes from 0.91 at idle to 1.22 when running flat out at BCLK=150.

What is a fan slot?
 
Joined
May 20, 2009
Messages
7
Location
New York
In the olden days of MS-DOS, you could do it within the OS. Now, for best (and easiest) results, grab a $50 program (with a free trial) like SuperSpeed RAM Disk. (http://www.superspeed.com/desktop/ramdisk.php) Works quite well and supports XP, Vista, and Win 7.

Install the program, select how much RAM you would like to use, and you'll see it takes that RAM and creates a drive in My Computer. Use this like a HD, but beware that any thing you put on it will be gone if you shut down or reboot. For scratch drives, where the above isn't a concern, nothing's better!

EDIT: For completeness, after you setup the RAM drive, you'll want to go into Photoshop's settings and set it's scratch drive to the RAM drive you created.
Thanks a lot! much appreciated.
 
Joined
Mar 26, 2009
Messages
32
Location
New York
I'm guessing that case airflow is the problem here. A PSU and CPU fan alone are insufficient to cool components within a desktop case. Your case should have mounts for additional fans in key areas. For instance, there should be an area to mount one or two exhaust fans in the rear of the case. There may also be provisions to mount several exhaust fans at the top of your case. Lastly, there may be several mounts at the bottom and/or in the front of your case (ahead of the hard drive bays) to mount intake fans.

You need at least a rear exhaust fan to push the heat generated from your cpu out of the case. Go over the manual or spec sheet that came with your case to determine what size fans will fit, and how many. Additional fans will continue to improve airflow, but an exhaust fan is a must for a conventional full tower case.

In a pinch, any fan of the correct size will do. However, it pays to be selective when buying case fans to maximize cooling ability over noise and cost. Scythe's S-Flex and Gentle Typhoon fans are very well regarded for their cooling ability / noise ratio, but are a bit pricey at $15-$25 a piece. I personally prefer Yate Loon fans, which can be ordered from specialty PC cooling shops like PetrasTechShop or Jab-Tech. Both Scythes and Yate Loons are available at different speeds, where higher speed fans create more air flow, but also more noise. Choose based on your priority for air flow over noise (although note that low speed fans may not improve air flow much.)
 

Growltiger

Administrator
Administrator
Joined
Apr 26, 2008
Messages
12,354
Location
Up in the hills, Gloucestershire, UK
I don't see how the poor case air flow can entirely explain the CPU temperature, because it increases and decreases so quickly depending on loading. I think it needs a better CPU cooler.

I've tracked down the case. It is an Apex PC-115. Probably about the cheapest and worst case ever. I replaced the power supply when I first had it, as the original was very loud. I put in a 460W Zalman, which is fine. The case doesn't have fans and isn't designed for them.

I understand that what I should really do is buy a new case with fans, and a more powerful power supply and a better CPU cooler. But this is not my main machine, which is yet to be bought. Doing this upgrade has taught me a lot and I'm much better prepared for specifying a complete new system.

So I've decided to live with this machine as it is. I'm going to leave BCLK set to 150. In normal operation the maximum temperature is reaching about 65, it is only when I run prime95 that it soars to 90. No doubt some Photoshop operations will make it work hard, but these are not usually continuous for long periods. Also it appears to work perfectly well with BCLK=150.

Thanks for your help. It is good to be getting 3.15GHz instead of 2.66 (or 2.8). It now does the Photoshop benchmark in 9 seconds. (Before the upgrade the benchmark took 80 seconds - that was with a Pentium 4, 3GHz. This is a huge improvement.)
 
Joined
Mar 26, 2009
Messages
32
Location
New York
I don't see how the poor case air flow can entirely explain the CPU temperature, because it increases and decreases so quickly depending on loading. I think it needs a better CPU cooler.
The quick change in temp is simply a nature of the processor, regardless of how it's cooled. Both my stock air-cooled 920 C0 at work and my custom water cooled 920 D0 at home do the same thing. I'll stress again that case airflow is the number one concern. Even if you put a TRUE 120 or Megahelems on the processor (two of the best air coolers on the market,) they won't be much help if the hot air gets trapped in the case.
 

Growltiger

Administrator
Administrator
Joined
Apr 26, 2008
Messages
12,354
Location
Up in the hills, Gloucestershire, UK
Yes, you must be right. There is very hot air coming out of the case, so it is even hotter in there. How can the CPU cooling fan possibly work well when it is blowing hot air across itself.

I just measured the core temperature while running the Photoshop benchmark and it climbed to a maximum of 77. So I think I'm OK using BCLK=150. Does this sound sensible to you or would you go back to 133?

For my new machine later this year (it will have the same model of motherboard, CPU and memory), should I go with a good case and fans, or should I also go with an after market CPU cooler? I don't use games and I would be very happy to get the speed up to say 3.6GHz.
 
Joined
Mar 26, 2009
Messages
32
Location
New York
A BLCK of 150 should be fine, but watch your temps. If you notice any system instability, you should back down.

If you're planning to overclock with your new rig, it is very important that you go with a good CPU cooler AND a good case with good fans.
 
Joined
Mar 26, 2009
Messages
32
Location
New York
Most good cases only come with one or two fans. Typically you supply your own seperately, so you have total control over air flow vs noise.

For full tower cases, Silverstone and Lian Li are probably tops, with Cooler Master not far behind. Antec is a popular mid-range option. Cases are a personal preference item, so it's down to looking at Newegg's stock and picking out a model you like. I use a Cooler Master Cosmos S which I like a great deal, as it's perfect for water cooling. For air cooling, you can get by on something smaller.
 

Growltiger

Administrator
Administrator
Joined
Apr 26, 2008
Messages
12,354
Location
Up in the hills, Gloucestershire, UK
I've ordered the Thermalright Ultra 120 Extreme 1366RT, which includes the 120mm fan, as per your advice. That should help cool the CPU.

After much investigation on cases I realised that the most basic and ridiculous thing wrong at the moment is the lack of a case fan. So perhaps I could get one of those instead of replacing the case. I took it apart and measured and the case allows for a 92mm fan, so I've ordered a Noctua NF-B9 92mm quiet case fan. I think this should make a huge difference, as it will assist the power supply fan in removing heat from the box.

I'm hoping that these two measures will improve the likely life of the system and perhaps reduce the temperature of the CPU enough to allow a bit more overclocking. I hope the idle temperature becomes a lot less than the current 52 degrees.

When I buy my new system I'll certainly get a better case although the compromise seems to be between quietness and cooling ability. I did see a midi size case called the Coolermaster Sileo 500 which has noise reduction built in, which looked an attractive idea. Clearly it is not a high performance case though.
 
Joined
May 7, 2008
Messages
656
Location
Roseville, California
George

Could you make sure you come back and give your impressions of the ASUS P6TD Deluxe. That is one my wish list and would like to know your thoughts. Dont forget to take pictures.
 

Growltiger

Administrator
Administrator
Joined
Apr 26, 2008
Messages
12,354
Location
Up in the hills, Gloucestershire, UK
So here is what happened next to my i7 920 upgrade in a cheap case.

First I fitted the case fan. This is the most basic thing, I would always make sure that any machine came with a case fan, but this one didn't.

Next I fitted the Thermalright CPU cooler.

Here are the temperatures. All with BCLK=150.

Machine idle
Before: RealTemp 44. Asus Probe CPU temp 45, motherboard 45
With case fan: RealTemp 47. Asus Probe CPU temp 37, motherboard 36
With case fan and CPU cooler: RealTemp 38. Asus Probe CPU temp 35, motherboard 37

So when idle the CPU core dropped by 6 and the motherboard dropped by 8.


Machine running prime95 flat out
Before: Realtemp 88. Asus Probe CPU temp 83, motherboard 54
With case fan: RealTemp 82. Asus Probe CPU temp 73, motherboard 37
With case fan and CPU cooler: RealTemp 70. Asus Probe CPU temp 67, motherboard 42

So when busy the CPU core dropped by 18 and the motherboard dropped by 12.

Very encouraging.

The next step was to see if I could now overclock a bit more. I increased BCLK to 166, giving about 3.5GHz (it uses a multiplier of 21).

Machine idle
With case fan and CPU cooler: RealTemp 44. Asus Probe CPU temp 40, motherboard 41

Machine running prime95 flat out
With case fan and CPU cooler: RealTemp 80. Asus Probe CPU temp 76, motherboard 45

So if you feel that a core temperature of 80 is a sensible limit, that exactly hits it, when running flat out for long periods.

Conclusion
1. A case fan is very important.

2. The Intel standard CPU cooler is not very good at all. I got an improvement of 12 degrees when the machine was busy by fitting a good one.

3. Even in a cheap case I can run the i7 920 at 3.5GHz, 25% more than the standard speed, without exceeding 80 degrees core temperature even when continuously 100% busy.

Photoshop benchmark
Without overclocking it took 9.5 secs.
It now takes just 7.8 secs.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Joined
Nov 17, 2007
Messages
2,192
Location
East of Everett Washington USA
George

Could you make sure you come back and give your impressions of the ASUS P6TD Deluxe. That is one my wish list and would like to know your thoughts. Dont forget to take pictures.
I'm not George... but everything works on my ASUS P6TD Deluxe... Except... the eSata.
Seems to be a known problem with the Marvell controller and certain eSata drives.

i7 920, 12 gig, 1 WD velociraptor, 3 WD 1Tb (2 in raid - 1 data)
 
Joined
Nov 15, 2007
Messages
291
Location
Seattle
Don't mind me, I've just been plugging along putting my system together when I can find a few free moments.

I'm posting this from the new build and everything has gone without a hitch so far.

My goal was fast, stable and quiet.

I haven't tried a large batch program yet but I did load Nikon View and opened a folder of a few hundred NEF's and they appeared instantly versus the annoying wait I lived through with my previous system.

I haven't played with overclocking yet but the CPU temp reads 35 C as I type this and that's with the case closed up.

An quiet! I can barely hear it and that is with 4 ea. 120mm case fans and the two 120mm fans on my CPU cooler.

Not sure what you want to see on in the way of pictures since the CPU cooler blocks half the board but here is a quick snap shot.

Subscribe to see EXIF info for this image (if available)
 

Growltiger

Administrator
Administrator
Joined
Apr 26, 2008
Messages
12,354
Location
Up in the hills, Gloucestershire, UK
George

I would be very interested in your equivalent figures to mine (a few posts above).

The four key numbers are:
1. RealTemp core CPU temperature when idle
2. Asus Probe CPU temperature when idle.
3 and 4. Same but after 10 minutes or more of running the prime95 torture test (small FFT option), which is what you need to run for overclocking testing.

I simply altered BCLK for overclocking. I know one can do much more that that kept it very simple.

I will be building a second system more similar to yours and want to see how much better yours performs than my current one - your good case and all those fans should help.
 

Latest posts

Links on this page may be to our affiliates. Sales through affiliate links may benefit this site.
Nikon Cafe is a fan site and not associated with Nikon Corporation.
Forum post reactions by Twemoji: https://github.com/twitter/twemoji
Copyright © 2005-2019 Amin Forums, LLC
Top Bottom