Banding examples and photos for your information...

[Commodorefirst]

Yes,

I have just discovered that both of my D200 cameras have banding issues.

Before a recent photo event I knew that I had Type 1 banding, or short banding as nikon calls it now, in both cameras, but only when shooting at high contrast areas, at ISO 400+ and EV set to +4. I never had it occur in usual photog situations, including indoors with ISO up to 1600 and incandescent lighting.

On Thursday evening at an important event, it reared it's ugly head. Thank goodness this wasn't a paid gig, just my own personal use and for my family, but I could have easily been in a similar situation when hired.

I was at an indoor board meeting with mixture of incandescent and fluorescent lights. I was not overexposed, I was shooting raw, ISO 800, no flash, and Auto WB, auto everything in Raw.

I checked the histogram for settings,highlights, and shot the event. When I arrived at home my jaw dropped. Where were the great ISO 800 photos, clear and sharp that I had expected, that I have had before? Why was everything "fuzzy" A quick 100% view showed me why- Banding. now if I printed at 4x6 or even 5x7 you wouldn't notice, but at 8x10 or larger, the image would be affected due to lack of sharpness and detail.

Further more I was able to reproduce this in my own finished basement with both cameras at the same setting. This occurred with both my 28mm 1.4 and 50mm 1.4 lenses set at f2 and shutter between 1/160- 1/250, ISO 800, shooting both raw and JPG fine. Both Cameras! The problem seems to be the strong Fluorescent lights in my basement and the board room. If the light fixtures were in the frame the banding was worse, if they weren't in the frame, generally banding wasn't there. They only had to be in the frame just a tiny bit for this to occur!

lots of pics to follow, disclaimer: Shots on the CPU and at low resolution don't show the full extent of the banding, things are much worse than these photos and crops show.

First, a general shot I took getting settings for the event before it occurred.

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a closeup of this shot, note banding in CPu screen, window, blue chair, everywhere...

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Shots in my basement, 100% crops:

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And a shot without banding: only difference is not having the ceiling light fixture in the shot. this is close to a 200% crop, much better than the other shots....

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so, off to Nikon they go (one at a time though!)

Nearly 6000 shots between the two cameras and never had this problem before, but I have never shot indoors with flor fixtures at ISO 800 either.

Please note, I am not trying to inflame anyone, just presenting my cameras, my situation, and my solution (send to Nikon, and insist firmly and politely on a fix).

Hoping the best for all of you and your D200 cameras

Wade

 

[Kerry Pierce]

Yup, that looks like a clear example of the "long banding" as described by nikon. :frown:

That's a bummer, Wade. Hope you get them repaired quickly.

 

[eng45ine]

Yes,

I have just discovered that both of my D200 cameras have banding issues.

Before a recent photo event I knew that I had Type 1 banding, or short banding as nikon calls it now, in both cameras, but only when shooting at high contrast areas, at ISO 400+ and EV set to +4. I never had it occur in usual photog situations, including indoors with ISO up to 1600 and incandescent lighting.

On Thursday evening at an important event, it reared it's ugly head. Thank goodness this wasn't a paid gig, just my own personal use and for my family, but I could have easily been in a similar situation when hired.

I was at an indoor board meeting with mixture of incandescent and flor. lights. I was not overexposed, I was shooting raw, ISO 800, no flash, and Auto WB, auto everything in Raw.

I checked the histogram for settings,highlights, and shot the event. When I arrived at home my jaw dropped. Where were the great ISO 800 photos, clear and sharp that I had expected, that I have had before? Why was everything "fuzzy" A quick 100% view showed me why- Banding. now if I printed at 4x6 or even 5x7 you wouldn't notice, but at 8x10 or larger, the image would be affected due to lack of sharpness and detail.

Further more I was able to reproduce this in my own finished basement with both cameras at the same setting. This occurred with both my 28mm 1.4 and 50mm 1.4 lenses set at f2 and shutter between 1/160- 1/250, ISO 800, shooting both raw and JPG fine. Both Cameras! The problem seems to be the strong Florescent lights in my basement and the board room. If the light fixtures were in the frame the banding was worse, if they weren't in the frame, generally banding wasn't there. They only had to be in the frame just a tiny bit for this to occur!

lots of pics to follow, disclaimer: Shots on the CPU and at low resolution don't show the full extent of the banding, things are much worse than these photos and crops show.


so, off to Nikon they go (one at a time though!)

Nearly 6000 shots between the two cameras and never had this problem before, but I have never shot indoors with flor fixtures at ISO 800 either.

Please note, I am not trying to inflame anyone, just presenting my cameras, my situation, and my solution (send to Nikon, and insist firmly and politely on a fix).

Hoping the best for all of you and your D200 cameras

Wade

Hi Wade,

I am so sorry to read that your two D200's have some issues, but I am glad that you are sending them to Nikon for adjustments. I hope that when they are back in your hands, they work perfectly. I also appreciate that you mentioned that you didn't want to perpetuate the continuing saga about banding issues. I can only assume that many are frustrated with having issues with their new cameras, but vocalizing displeasure here is not the way to resolve anything. You are proceeding with the proper steps...bring it to Nikon and have them make the necessary repairs.

 

[Michael Mohrmann]

I have just discovered that both of my D200 cameras have banding issues.

Both? Most estimates (guesses!) place the long banding defect rate at 1-3%. So, the odds of having two such cameras would be less than 1 in 1000.

Good luck with the repairs.

 

[Commodorefirst]

I have decided to send both in the at the same time for repair, and yes both do have it, however, both are early models, first run shall we say. Since I took the time to take photos with both that exhibit this long vertical striping as nikon calls it (at least they acknowledge the problem officially now) I thought I should just send in everything in at once.

long sigh......

fortunately I didn't sell both of my D70 cameras, just one, so I still have one DSLR in the house.

At least I know how and where to check to see if the problem is fixed when it comes back.

Funny how it took ISO 800 under fluorescent lights to bring the problem out. Even doing the tough +4 EV, high iso on a strong light source (incandescent), only brought out light type 1 banding. As you can see above, I seem to have hit the jackpot on type 3 or long vertical banding with fluorescent fixtures at ISO 800 with a fluorescent fixture in the photograph. Didn't happen with the fixture out of the field of view, (at least on my two cameras)

thanks

Wade

 

[mike17112]

Thank you Wade for a well thought out and factual post on banding. At least you were not trying an impossible shot to try and induce the problem. As a matter of interest how long have you had your D200's? I have mine on order and and wondering if mine when I finally get it is likely to experience problems.

 

[Commodorefirst]

Hi Wade,

I am so sorry to read that your two D200's have some issues, but I am glad that you are sending them to Nikon for adjustments. I hope that when they are back in your hands, they work perfectly. I also appreciate that you mentioned that you didn't want to perpetuate the continuing saga about banding issues. I can only assume that many are frustrated with having issues with their new cameras, but vocalizing displeasure here is not the way to resolve anything. You are proceeding with the proper steps...bring it to Nikon and have them make the necessary repairs.

Yes, I don't want to get into disagreements, arguments, or thoughts that it isn't a big deal, etc. etc. I am for sure not going to post this over you know where! lol

Just providing info for others and my thoughts on how I discovered it, and what I am doing about it. Information, pure and simple, no hype, no teeth nashing, just keeping my fingers crossed.

Wade

 

[Commodorefirst]

Thank you Wade for a well thought out and factual post on banding. At least you were not trying an impossible shot to try and induce the problem. As a matter of interest how long have you had your D200's? I have mine on order and and wondering if mine when I finally get it is likely to experience problems.

I received my first from Roberts on Dec 16 I think, and I got one from Best Buy from their first shipment about a month ago. both first batches. Nikon has stated oficially that "newer cameras are adjusted properly and only early shipments seem to have this problem." source here for that info: http://www.digitalreview.ca/cams/NikonD200_bandingnotice.shtml

I only posted this since it was real world shots, I could reproduce it in both cameras, and the stripes affected the quality of the photos of an important family event.

Wade

 

[ozarkshome]

Truly sorry you have the banding problem. Hope Nikon gets it cured for you quickly. I guess while you are waiting you can at least get acquainted with your new tripod, while I am waiting for my half ball.

 

[Commodorefirst]

Truly sorry you have the banding problem. Hope Nikon gets it cured for you quickly. I guess while you are waiting you can at least get acquainted with your new tripod, while I am waiting for my half ball.

yes I will,

thanks

Wade

 

[Leif]

Both? Most estimates (guesses!) place the long banding defect rate at 1-3%. So, the odds of having two such cameras would be less than 1 in 1000.

Good luck with the repairs.

A probability of 1 in 1000 assumes uncorrelated (Bayesian) statistics. In other words, it assumes that each camera was picked at random from the factory output. If he bought them both at the same time, and they are from the same batch, then the probability is more like 100% that if one has banding, then both do. The fact that both have banding is not so surprising.

Leif

 

[StL_Don]

Wade,
That's tough luck!
Sending them both together is at least going to save you a little on shipping. Hopefully they won't be swamped and will get them back to you quickly.

We need to hook up again so I can see that sexy tripod

Don

 

[ozarkshome]

I received my Sachtler also. NICE! verrrry nice.

 

[Kerry Pierce]

Yes, I don't want to get into disagreements, arguments, or thoughts that it isn't a big deal, etc. etc. I am for sure not going to post this over you know where! lol

Wade

You don't have to worry about posting it over on you know where. Somebody else kindly did it for you, rather shortly after your initial post.

 

[AFS]

A bit OT, but can I have all those startrek books :wink:

 

[Commodorefirst]

A bit OT, but can I have all those startrek books :wink:

Pm sent....

 

[Commodorefirst]

You don't have to worry about posting it over on you know where. Somebody else kindly did it for you, rather shortly after your initial post.

Hmm, I didnt' see that Kerry, Do you rememeber which of the thousands of posts on banding it was in? Probably in the middle of a feud between folks.

Wade

 

[Kerry Pierce]

Hmm, I didnt' see that Kerry, Do you rememeber which of the thousands of posts on banding it was in? Probably in the middle of a feud between folks.

Wade

Sorry Wade, I don't recall which thread it is in. :frown: All I really remember is that someone used it as an example of how bad nikon and the d200 are and that there were no replies to your post here, when I clicked on the link.

I didn't think much about it at the time. It wasn't presented with false embellishments, so wasn't of much interest to me.

 

[hotrod4x5]

This is the post you are looking http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1021&message=17139893
This is how I found and now am a member of Nikon Cafe.

 

[Steve Bingham]

With fluorescents cycling at 60 cps I wonder if that has anything to do with it??? Sort of like shooting the TV screen and seeing the scan lines. Are we seeing the light as light lines cycling on and off? I noticed a long time ago that neon and florescent lights were in a lot (not all) long banding shots. I wonder, also, it this could be enhanced by shutter speeds as multiples of 60 (1/60, 1/120, 1/180, 1/240, 1/300) - perhaps adding as harmonic mixes.